Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years - Ford Focus Electric Forum
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:58 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

Pleaese read the New York Times link below -

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/05/bu...t.html?_r=1&hp

I do not disagree with the article. I find myself in the catagory of "It's the right thing to do." Additionally, for me, I will see a payoff due to the way I drive, the length of time I keep automobiles and the amount of miles I drive annually. It will, however, take a number of years. Plus, I cannot wait to drive by every gas station I see without having to stop.

We have rehashed this subject at length. It isn't the facts that matter it is the perception. The NYTimes is a very viable and visible information provider and trend setter. So I want to pass it along.
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Old 04-05-2012, 04:07 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

No doubt it can take 6-12 years for a Volt payback the cost difference between it and the Cruze.

I strongly object to the articles 27 year payback figure. And I also object to the gas would have to cost $13.50 number quoted by the Lundberg Survey. Let us recall that Lundberg is an outfit whose very existence is tied to the Oil Industry.

The fact is the Volt can readily save $1000-$1500 per year in fuel and maintenance costs compared to the Cruze. And that's comparing it to a car that gets 40 on the highway and 33 combined.

If you are a person who MUST change cars frequently regardless of their viability, or you are person who doesn't care about sending money overseas to people who are actively plotting against... then by all means buy the gasser.

Because there is no engine or transmission to break down, I think the life expectancy of the BEVs like the Focus Electric can probably be measured in decades. Which makes the life time total cost of ownership very attractive.

This is to say nothing of comparing the supreme ride of the Volt with that of the Cruze. The Volt could easily have been a Cadillac based on the refinement of its ride and appointments.



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Old 04-06-2012, 03:50 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

You go Charged up... I'm with you and certainly will enjoy the last laugh.....
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Old 04-06-2012, 07:46 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

We've had a lot of debate on this article on other forums; bottom line is that just like the EPA mileage numbers ... your actual mileage may vary ... the same with calculating the differences on expected 'pay back' as well as what vehicles a person would cross-shop. When we wanted to replace our '06 Mazda3 5-door 'GT' (Grand Touring; included lot's of 'luxury' extras even though moderately priced, many of which simply were not available on 'comparable' models), we considered the LEAF (which we bought), the FFE (still not available) and a Lexus CT200h ... a Prius wasn't in the running as I didn't like the styling and seat comfort; a Volt was passed over due to tight back seats and it also had no availability (at the time). We didn't even consider the Versa (which the NYT article refers to) or any other lower priced high-MPG compacts as the primary driver has only a 7 mile round trip on most days and a pure ICE barely warms up -- as BEV's don't matter how long or short a drive you take (as long as it's within range), we either needed a plug-in hybrid (with at least the 7 mile R/T range) or a pure BEV, so the CT200h was out. As we didn't want to really want to wait another year or so, the LEAF was it. Each 'story' as to why you bought a particular make/model will be unique based on a persons needs at the time, what the market had available and lastly the financial aspect (budget, etc.). Now the 'pay off' during the little over 3 months that we've owned it, is that it's sharing commuter duty between two of us (mine is a 30 mile commute so still within range) and we use it weekends instead of our other ICE vehicles. I've noticed about a $12/mo increase in our electric bill, but we're saving about $300/mo on gas (using last years prices; the highest per gallon price for regular in Chicago is now $4.96 so would be a lot more). This has worked so well that we'll consider a plug-in hybrid to replace the main 'trip' car (an '09 VW Routan with a 4.0L) once something comparable is available -- the Ford C-Max Energi is right up there but hopefully others will be out as well. As what (if anything) we'll be able to cross-shop that with I'm not sure ... hopefully more choices but again, being able to drive realtively short distances on pure battery will be a top consideration based on our needs. Actual owner 'needs' the author only touches on briefly, perhaps they'll expand it to explore it further but it appears a lot of Volt and LEAF owners have added their own comments already ...
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Old 04-07-2012, 02:07 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

Quote:
Each 'story' as to why you bought a particular make/model will be unique based on a persons needs at the time, what the market had available and lastly the financial aspect
Good comments as always Red. Certainly an EV or PHEV requires more thoughtful consideration, than pulling the trigger on just any gasser.



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Old 04-07-2012, 10:48 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

When someone buys a new car, and they talk about how they got the upgraded model, not base model, no one asks them, "Well, what's the payback for that upgrade?"

Yet, when we talk about electric propulsion, we seem to need to justify it's payback $$? Excuse me, but I enjoy driving pollution free (don't you wish everyone did!), driving by gas stations for months at a time, and not funding countries who hate us.

Here's a funny looking guy, and his pretty wife, making just that point...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8vSU5vf0qI
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Old 04-08-2012, 05:52 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

Thanks so much for the video. Says it all perfectly
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Old 04-14-2012, 07:07 AM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

nice post.. i don't agree to that
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Old 04-14-2012, 07:55 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

Tireboy - Would you mind expanding your answer? What exactly do you not agree with?
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Old 04-15-2012, 01:02 AM   #10 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Payoff for Efficient Cars takes Years

Did they compare just the purchase price in the article? Most only focus on the initial price, which is poor financial planning. Cars rarely depreciate to zero before you sell them. You have to factor in resale price and depreciation.

To make this a fair comparison, you have to figure out what the resale value of the car will be when you sell it and factor that into the equation. When you do that, the more expensive cars usually compare a lot more favorably.
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